I've accepted an answer, but sadly, I believe we're stuck with our original worst case scenario: CAPTCHA everyone on purchase attempts of the crap. Short explanation: caching / web farms make it impossible to track hits, and any workaround (sending a non-cached web-beacon, writing to a unified table, etc.) slows the site down worse than the bots would. There is likely some pricey hardware from Cisco or the like that can help at a high level, but it's hard to justify the cost if CAPTCHA-ing everyone is an alternative. I'll attempt a more full explanation later, as well as cleaning this up for future searchers (though others are welcome to try, as it's community wiki).

情况

这是关于woot.com上的垃圾销售。我是Woot Workshop的总统,Woot Workshop是Woot的子公司,负责设计,撰写产品描述,播客,博客文章,并主持论坛。我使用CSS/HTML,对其他技术几乎不熟悉。我与开发人员密切合作,在这里讨论了所有的答案(以及我们的许多其他想法)。

可用性是我工作的重要组成部分,而让网站变得令人兴奋和有趣则是剩下的大部分工作。这就是下面三个目标的来源。验证码损害了可用性,机器人从我们的垃圾销售中偷走了乐趣和兴奋。

机器人一秒钟就会在我们的首页上猛击数十次屏幕抓取(和/或扫描我们的RSS),以寻找随机垃圾销售。他们一看到这个,就会触发程序的第二阶段登录,点击“我要一个”,填好表格,然后买下这些垃圾。

评价

lc:在stackoverflow和其他使用此方法的站点上,他们几乎总是处理已验证(登录)的用户,因为正在尝试的任务需要这样。

在Woot上,匿名(未登录)用户可以查看我们的主页。换句话说,撞击机器人可以不经过身份验证(除了IP地址之外基本上无法跟踪)。

所以我们又回到了扫描IP, a)在这个云网络和垃圾邮件僵尸的时代是相当无用的,b)考虑到来自一个IP地址的业务数量,捕获了太多无辜的人(更不用说非静态IP isp的问题和试图跟踪它的潜在性能影响)。

还有,让别人给我们打电话是最糟糕的情况。我们能让他们给你打电话吗?

布拉德克:内德·巴切德的方法看起来很酷,但它们是专门设计来击败为网络站点构建的机器人的。我们的问题是机器人是专门用来破坏我们网站的。其中一些方法可能只在很短的时间内有效,直到脚本编写人员将他们的机器人进化为忽略蜜罐,从屏幕上抓取附近的标签名称而不是表单id,并使用支持javascript的浏览器控件。

 

lc再次说道:“当然,除非炒作是你们营销计划的一部分。”是的,绝对是。当物品出现时的惊喜,以及当你设法得到一件物品时的兴奋,可能比你实际得到的垃圾一样重要,甚至更重要。任何消除先到/先得的东西都不利于“赢”的快感。

 

novatrust:就我个人而言,欢迎我们新的机器人霸主。我们实际上提供RSSfeeds,允许第三方应用程序扫描我们的网站的产品信息,但不是在主站HTML之前。如果我的理解正确的话,你的解决方案通过完全牺牲目标1来帮助目标2(性能问题),并放弃机器人将购买大部分垃圾的事实。我给你的回答投了赞成票,因为你最后一段的悲观情绪对我来说是准确的。这里似乎没有什么灵丹妙药。

其余的响应通常依赖于IP跟踪,这似乎是无用的(僵尸网络/僵尸/云网络)和有害的(捕获许多来自相同IP目的地的无辜的人)。

还有其他方法/想法吗?我的开发人员一直在说“让我们只做验证码”,但我希望有更少的侵入性方法,让所有真正想要我们的垃圾的人。

最初的问题

假设你卖的东西很便宜,但有很高的感知价值,而你的数量非常有限。没有人确切地知道你什么时候会卖这个东西。超过一百万人经常来看你卖什么。

你最终会发现脚本和机器人试图通过编程方式[a]找出你何时出售该道具,[b]确保他们是第一批购买该道具的人。这很糟糕,有两个原因:

你的网站被非人类攻击,拖慢了所有人的速度。 编剧最终“赢得”了产品,让常客感到被骗了。

一个看似显而易见的解决方案是为用户在下单前设置一些障碍,但这至少有三个问题:

The user experience sucks for humans, as they have to decipher CAPTCHA, pick out the cat, or solve a math problem. If the perceived benefit is high enough, and the crowd large enough, some group will find their way around any tweak, leading to an arms race. (This is especially true the simpler the tweak is; hidden 'comments' form, re-arranging the form elements, mis-labeling them, hidden 'gotcha' text all will work once and then need to be changed to fight targeting this specific form.) Even if the scripters can't 'solve' your tweak it doesn't prevent them from slamming your front page, and then sounding an alarm for the scripter to fill out the order, manually. Given they get the advantage from solving [a], they will likely still win [b] since they'll be the first humans reaching the order page. Additionally, 1. still happens, causing server errors and a decreased performance for everyone.

另一种解决方案是经常监视ip攻击,阻止它们进入防火墙,或以其他方式阻止它们排序。这个可以解2。和阻止[b],但扫描ip对性能的影响是巨大的,可能会导致更多像1这样的问题。比编剧自己造成的还要严重。此外,云网络和垃圾邮件僵尸的可能性使得IP检查相当无用。

第三个想法,强迫订单表单加载一段时间(比如半秒),可能会减慢快速订单的进度,但同样,脚本编写人员仍然是第一个进入的人,在任何速度下都不会对实际用户造成损害。

目标

将道具卖给非脚本人。 保持网站运行的速度不被机器人减慢。 不要让“正常”用户完成任何任务来证明他们是人类。


当前回答

一些想法:

Simple: don't name it "Random Crap." Change the name of the item every time so that the bots will have a harder time identifying it. They may still look for the $1.00 items, in which case I suggest occasionally selling $1 sticks of gum for a few minutes. The $5 shipping should make it worth your while. Harder: don't make the users do anything extra - make the users' computers do something extra. Write a JavaScript function that performs an intensive calculation taking a good amount of processing power - say, the ten-millionth prime number - and have the user's computer calculate that value and pass it back before you accept the order (perhaps even to create the "place order" URL). Change the function for every BoC so that bots can't pre-calculate and cache results (but so that you can). The calculation overhead might just slow down the bots enough to keep them off your backs - if nothing else, it would slow the hits on your servers so that they could breathe. You could also vary the depth of the calculation - ten-millionth prime versus hundred-millionth - at random so that the ordering process is no longer strictly first-come, first served, and to avoid penalizing customers with slower computers. E

其他回答

我同意OP在这里-请不要验证码-这不是一个非常woot的做事方式。

首先设置一些机器人陷阱。我会在主页上更经常地提到BOC,让机器人看起来不智能,所以每次措辞都不同。“中行投诉上升!”所以扫描关键词的机器人会被困住。

然而,我认为真正的问题是双重的,首先是你需要解决的性能问题,今天是机器人造成了一个问题,但它向我表明,有一个性能问题需要解决。

其次,这是一个商业机会,可以把一些真正的垃圾转化为利润。所以我将保持整体woot风格并声明“我们检查机器人”。如果我们认为你是机器人,你就会得到一盒垃圾。”

机器人检查将在销售完成后的某个时间离线完成,使用机器人陷阱,IP号码,cookie,会话,浏览器字符串等。对你获得的购买者数据做一些认真的分析,以决定谁得到了废话。如果你决定发布垃圾,那么你就可以把一些正常的垃圾卖给别人。

只有当机器人用户用无效的信用卡付款时,这才会成为问题。那么,一个非技术的解决方案如何?

只要他们的付款是有效的,就将机器人用户视为普通用户,并确保你有足够的库存来满足总需求。

结果是:销量增加。你做生意是为了赚钱,对吧?

我的想法(我还没有检查所有其他的,所以我不知道它是否新颖)

处理蜂群:

Convert the front-page matter for each day's stuff to be a flash/flex object. Yes, some people will complain, but we're looking for the common case here, not the ideal. You should also randomize the name of your flash objects, so they aren't in any predictable pattern of names. Using Akamai or another CDN, deploy this flash object in advance to the outside world. Akamai produces what appears to be random URLs, so it makes it hard to predict. When it is time for a new sale, you just have to change your URL locally to refer to the appropriate object at Akamai, and people will go fetch the flash object from them to discover if the deal is a BoC or not.

一天结束-你现在有Akamai处理你的午夜交通蜂群

处理购车事宜

Each of the flash objects you create can have lots and lots of content hidden inside - images, links, arbitrary ids, including 'bag of crap' in a thousand places. you should be able to obfuscate the flash as well. When the flash object "goes live", people will start to attack it. But there are so many false positives that a simple string scan is useless - they'll have to simulate running the flash locally. But the flash doesn't write text. It draws lines and shapes. Shapes in different colors, all connected to timers that make them appear and disappear at different times. If you've seen the Colbert Report, you know how the intro has hundreds of words describing Colbert. Imagine something like that for your intro, which will always include Bag O Crap. Now, imagine that the intro takes an arbitrary amount of time - sometimes a few seconds, sometimes as long as a minute or more (make it funny) Meanwhile, "Bag O Crap" is constantly showing up, but again, clearly as part of the intro. Finally, the actual deal of the day is revealed, with an active 'shimmer' effect that makes it difficult for any single snapshot of the canvas to reveal the actual product name. This is floating above an animated background that still says 'bag O crap' and is constantly in motion again, all of this is handled with lines and shapes, not with text strings

最终的结果是——你的黑客被迫拍摄交易的大量图像快照,弄清楚如何分离所有的假阳性和识别实际交易。与此同时,人类只是看着它,由于眼睛疲劳和我们填补文本空白的能力,我们可以原原本本地阅读交易。

这不会永远有效,但会在一段时间内有效。

另一个想法是简单地限制人们购买中行,除非他们以前用该账户购买过东西,并且永远不让他们再购买中行。

我的解决方案是市场变革和技术变革的结合。

目前,销售垃圾促销袋部分的技术方面被处理为正常的woot销售。促销开始了,人们争相购买,所有的商品都卖光了。用于日常销售的相同统计图表都是用过的垃圾销售。

这里涉及到几个市场目标:

Get customers to visit the site once every day (impluse purchasing). The possiblility of a seeing a bag of crap sale is the reason/reward. Network/viral/gossipy effect where a customer sees a bag of crap sale is on they will IM/EMail/Telephone their friends. There is also what I'd call general "good will". Woot is a really cool place because it occasionally rewards its customers with amazing sales (bag of crap that included a flat panel tv)... AND its done in a fair "first comes first served" manner.

前两个似乎是最重要的。纯粹的访客数量会影响正常交易的销售速度(或销售一空)。传统上,新客户主要是通过口口相传来吸引的,让客户把自己的朋友推荐到woot.com是一种胜利。

所以…我的解决方案是将促销活动的递送方式改为更多的抽奖方式。

偶尔用户可以做一些有趣的事情,看看他们是否有资格得到一袋垃圾。有趣的内容可以是类似“punch The monkey”或Orbitz迷你看球游戏、棒球或曲棍球的愚蠢flash游戏。这里的目标是机器人无法编写脚本的游戏,因此需要相当谨慎。我们的目标也不仅仅是给游戏赢家一袋垃圾……但对所有游戏玩家来说。

The technical core of the game is that at the end of the game a request is made to a server that does an "instant lottery" to determine if the user has won a bag of crap sale opportunity. The server request will need to include something calculated by the game itself (roughly speaking "hash cash"... a complex, CPU cycle consuming, calculation, and hopefully one that is difficult to reproduce). This is to prevent a bot from repeatedly entering the lottery just be querying the lottery server/service.

游戏本身也会随着时间而改变。你可以为万圣节、圣诞节、情人节、复活节等制作特殊事件游戏。还有许多有趣的营销理念可以与woot的“wooiness”相匹配。

If the user wins they can purchase N bags of crap (in a time limited window)... but they can also send N friends a time limited invitation to purchase a bag of crap (good for 24 hours). This provides a super strong network effect... customers will definately tell their friends. Or you could also do it as "buy 1 give 1"... let customers buy up to a total of N but force every second one to be shipped to a friend. The key here is to make the network/gossip effect an full fledged part... help the customer tell the world about the wonderfulness of woot.

促销材料周围袋垃圾销售概念也将需要修改。一袋垃圾多快卖完的图表已经无关紧要了。比如每个月人们有多少次机会购买。有多少人告诉他们的朋友。材料应该微妙地强调这一点,每天去拜访是一个好主意。

你也可以宣传为什么一袋垃圾的销售正在改变。尤其是你免费雇佣了最烂的顾问。

让用户在原价和更高的价格之间做出选择。 你必须找到某种方法,将按钮与它们各自的价格联系起来——颜色、位置,也许还有按钮的“情感内涵”——这很难通过编程来确定,但只需要用户将按钮与价格联系起来。 对用户来说简单,直观,没有麻烦,但对脚本编写人员来说困难,更重要的是,有风险——特别是如果您改变了关联方法。